Read + Write + Report
Home | Start a blog | About Orble | FAQ | Sites | Writers | Advertise | My Orble | Login

HOW OLD WERE YOU WHEN YOU STARTED SCHOOL?

February 7th 2008 03:44
I was five. I am a January baby so when I started school there were some kids older than me and some kids younger than me. It didn’t faze me; it’s just how it was.

I grew up in NSW where the NSW Department of Education and Training website says that, “Children may enter Kindergarten at the beginning of the school year in NSW government schools if they turn five on or before 31 July in that year.”

With the school year starting in February, the child can be as young as 4 years and 6 months old. But the child doesn’t have to start that young, however, the child “must start school by their sixth birthday”. So if a child turns 6 in February, the child can start then. That leaves a possible 18 month gap between the eldest child and the youngest child.

And that this tender age, 18 months in a MASSIVE gap.

No wonder parents are taking matters into their own hands. Here is a link to an article from smh.com.au late last year.

It illustrates the trend in the last few years to “hold kids back” another year before starting them (closer to their 6th birthday); instead of being one the youngest kids in the class, they will be one of the eldest.

As I said at the top the cut off date here in NSW is 31 July. So it wasn’t surprising to find a lot of July babies being held back. Then it was June babies and now it is not uncommon to find May babies held back.

Especially when it came to boys because experts say that boys do develop socially and academically slower than girls at that 4 – 6 year old age.

However, sometimes the reasons parents hold their children I don’t understand. Some don’t want their child to be the last to go through puberty….being the first doesn’t sound much like fun either. Oh, and if you can predict when your child will go through puberty, I’ll give you next week’s Lotto numbers.

Some don’t want their child to be the only 17 year old when everyone else is 18. Do you really want your child to be 18 when they’re in their final year of school? It seems like a distraction to me.

There is a big emphasis now on children being “socially” ready for school. I ask you this, how can a child be 100% ready for school? It’s not possible. In order for a child to be used to the routine of school, the child needs to attend school, to gain that experience.

In the smh.com.au article I refered to above, some parents want their children to be able to read, write, add and subtract before they go to school. What is school for then?

I did read in a Sydney’s Child article that whatever academic advantage those older children have in Kindergarten, usually all children level out by the age of 8.

Now obviously, no two children are the same and some children do need to be held back. Forcing a child to attend school too early is not the answer. When my second child Alex was born, I began hearing how he would be held back and school’s won’t take May babies, especially because he was a boy….he was only a few months old at the time and the decision had already been made by the general public.

Any guesses why my third child was born in October?

But Alex is so very ready to take that next step to go to school. More so than my daughter was when she started school (she’s a March baby); luckily for me my daughter had a smooth transition to school.

But when I submitted my son’s enrolment form, they looked at his birthday and said, “he’ll be one of the youngest (4 years and 9 months), we’ll have to keep an eye on him during orientation”. I later found out that the only reason he was offered a position at the school was because he is a sibling of a current student; otherwise I would have had to wait until the following year.

It occurred to then me that, if parents hold their children back, the older children will be given positions first because by law they need to be enrolled in school before their 6th birthday.

I know “they” say that if a child starts too early and has social problems that these problems can follow them right through their entire school career; and I appreciate that. Most teachers advise that a child be held back. But if my son was held back and had to start the following year, I truly believe that he would be bored and get up to mischief, more so than he would (will – though I hope he doesn’t) this year. I really do think he is at the right age to take that next step and be suitably stimulated.

My nephew started school at 5 years and 8 months. I asked him if he felt like he was the smartest or biggest and he said “No, I thought I was dumb because I was in a year with kids heaps younger than me”.

Now I can’t tell other parents what to do and other parents aren’t responsible for the welfare of my child, so the NSW Department of Education needs to step in and do something about this. An 18 month gap is too big.

Perhaps change the eligibility year from 1 August to 31 July to a straight calendar year (just like the school year is) so the youngest a child could be is 5 years, not 4 years and 6 months. And the eldest would be just shy of their 6th birthday. That alone decreases the age gap from a possible 18 months to a maximum of 12 months.

It almost sounds too easy. I’m not a trained educator or policy maker, so maybe there are issues I’m not even aware of. But I know what I see, and what I see isn’t working too well.

Access to preschools in NSW is abysmal; if more schools operated with better programs that coincided with school programs than perhaps children like my son, (who currently attends long day care with a preschool program) could find stimulation there before attending school.

Maybe my son is the exception to the rule. I do know of a boy who is only 1 month younger than Alex and he seems so much younger. Having said that, there is also another boy who is almost a year older than and he too seems ‘younger’. So age is not the only indicator.

When I started kindergarten there was a lot of finger painting, resting after lunch and craft. Not too much ‘academic’ type stuff. I remember that my teacher was impressed with me because I knew my home phone number. These days it is almost a prerequisite. With so much more expected of our children, no wonder parents choose to hold their kids back.

The curriculum seems to have changed. And if that’s the case, then the entry age needs to change to match the child’s ability to complete the curriculum.

Well, Alex started kindergarten this week and he just walked into his classroom like he owned the place. Why? Luckily for him it was the same classroom his sister had. And he already knows a lot of his classmates from playing in the playground the last two years while we waited for his sister to come out of class.

So age is not the only indicator.

It was quite a relief when the principal of the school yesterday mentioned to me that Alex has settled in quite nicely.

Yes he has; I knew he would.

****

Here are the guidelines for the other states in Australia.

The Victorian Department of Education and Early Childhood Development website says “Children must be five years of age or older by 30 April of the year they start school”.

The Tasmanian Department of Education website says “A child who has turned five on or by 1 January in any year must start school in that year.”

The Queensland Department of Education, Training and the Arts website says, “If your child was born in 2001, he or she would have likely attended preschool or a similar program in 2006 and will start Year 1 in 2007.”

The South Australian Department of Education and Children’s Services website says, “Five-year-old children who attend government schools usually start at the beginning of each of the four terms. Some schools also accept children immediately following their fifth birthday but it is not compulsory for them to start until they are six years old.”

I’d tell you what West Australia’s policy on this is….if I could find it.

Confused? I am.

159
Vote
Add To: del.icio.us Digg Furl Spurl.net StumbleUpon Yahoo


   
Subscribe to this blog 


Just this blog This blog and DailyOrble (recommended)

   

   


Comments
21 Comments. [ Add A Comment ]

Comment by Michaelie

February 7th 2008 07:45
I was four years and seven months. I'm so glad I started school then - even though I hated that everyone else had their licences at the end and I didn't - because I was very ready to go. As it is, I did half my classes with the year above in primary school, and the same with my units in the last half of highschool, so in Year Twelve, I only had half my subjects left to do to get my certificate.

The rules are very confusing, but generally sensible parents know where their child is at, I think, and hopefully will base a decision on that rather than any petty concerns.

Interesting post, Mrs M.

Michaelie

Comment by Mrs M

February 7th 2008 08:51
Hi Michaelie,

Aren't you the high achiever.

I agree, sensible parents do know where their children are at. And if they use the child's progress as a guide to making a decision then that's responsible parenting.

What bothers me is when parents use their own experience to make a decision for their kids and not take into consideration where the child is at. Am I making sense?

For example, one mum I know said she would keep her daughter back because when this mum was in school she was one of the youngest and she hated it. But to look at her daughter, she needed to go to school.

Or the whole puberty thing, it's awkward whenever you go through it.

But let me ask you this. You said that you hated that everyone had a licence and you didn't...in the end was it really that bad?

I can appreciate (and remember) what it's like to want something that everyone has, but once you get it, was the wait so bad?

The rules are confusing and really needs to be set nationally I think.

Thanks for the visit MIchaelie.

Love & stuff
Mrs M

Comment by Michaelie

February 7th 2008 09:04
But of course

Nah, I wasn't really, but I think that illustrates that my parents did the right thing for me. They held my youngest brother back, not because he wouldn't keep up in class, but because he was a troublemaker. So I think they considered what was best for each of us, and know exactly what you mean by parents making decisions for their kids.

The licence thing - it bothered me a little bit at the time, especially since I lived out of town, but at least I had plenty of other people to drive me around. Of course, it didn't matter in the long term, and would probably have annoyed me more if I had not been able to get into the pubs!

Comment by Michaelie

February 7th 2008 09:08
And another thing I liked about starting early - it meant I was able to defer from uni, and still finish my course at 21.

Comment by Anonymous

February 7th 2008 23:16
This is so very relevant to us,

I feel that our little man would have loved school this year, although he is not too confident within his own abilities, he's a really intelligent kid.

BUT...

We didnt' send him to school

I started young, my bday is April, hubby's bday is January he was started early then deliberately repeated... so for him, he didn't want our son to have to repeat if he couldn't keep up.

Now, the hard thing for me was that I believe my son would love school, it would be great for him, but can he compete against kids 18 months older than him and still have confidence in what he is doing?? No, I don't believe he could.

So unfortunately for us, and for our son, everybody else's tendency to "hold them back" has meant that I have also taken this path as I don't think it right to force him to compete with kids over a year older than him.

Does that make sense? I guess if the age gap were not an issue, he would have started school this month, but, instead he will start school next year, and still be slightly younger than some of the kids in the class as his bday is the end of May..

I am with you, there definately needs to be a change of policy!! I wish someboday had warned me about school entry age when I was planning my kids, I might have had them at a different time of year... LOL

Comment by Mrs M

February 8th 2008 00:01
Hi Anonymous,

I hear you and feel for you. It's frustrating when you're forced into a situation. I totally understand and agree with your decision to hold you child back. And mother's instinct is rarely wrong.

And there is the stress that we need to get it right here in Kindy because of the flow on effect into highschool.

Unfortunately, we can only make decisions with the facts that are placed in front of us now. No-one can predict with any accuracy how the child will do in highschool because there are so many other factors that come into play.

I can appreciate that there are 25 kids in a class so they do need to be able to fit into some sort of mould, but what also happened to catering for individual needs?

Thanks for the visit Anonymous

Love & stuff
Mrs M

Comment by Miswanderlust

February 10th 2008 03:10
I started school at 5 and my son began at 4. Starting at 4 was a struggle for my son as he is immature and found school challenging. He went to university and is quite a mature young man. My fingers were crossed for 20 years. He was in several fights at school and was considered a "gifted underachiever". Oh well it all worked out. If I could do it over I would have started my son at 5 years instead.
Mis

Comment by Mrs M

February 10th 2008 12:40
Hi Mis,

Hindsight is a wonderful thing Mis.

I read somewhere (reliable source I know....I should take more notice), that children's brain open up (or something) at around the age of four craving for information and then close up again. It takes whatever information it has and lays down foundations. The next time the brain opens up again is around the age of nine and it builds on the foundations it has already laid.

Does that sound right to you?

Love & stuff
Mrs M

Comment by Miswanderlust

February 10th 2008 19:23
Mrs. M
You are certainly right about the brain development in children. Also the brain "opens up again" during adolescence. Very heartening if you ask me!
Mis

Comment by Lilla

February 11th 2008 03:32
Mrs M,

Snap! I am January baby too and you just know I have strong opinions and views on all this stuff - which seems so fashionable now, rather than practical. But I have to err on the side of starting kids late... in fact, why not, not start them at all?

You know I am home schooling mine, so I am biased as to them being made to get along with mugs and thugs that any respecting adult would not have to subject to in grown life... but that is just me.

Coming from Europe I have to agree with the system there in starting them later, especially when you consider the Elizabethan 'trends' still practiced here in a climate that does nothing but stress our young in the hotter months. I mean fancy sending a 4 year old to a sweat box to be bullied and made to feel like a fool, becuase they have unique ideas.

Yes, my often combatative nature bears witness to my start being very shaky. Coming from migrant parents and not speaking English at the time, my Mum never started me until I was seven - partly due to ill health, (an allergy to my mother's ciggarette smoke which manifested as constant tonsilitis and chest infections).

I also had the added problem of having been left handed at birth and having it beaten out of me, to use my right hand instead, which to this day has caused great problems in my thinking patterns ... but at least I am no longer satanic in the eyes of good catholics everywhere.

Overall though, putting my own experiences and biases aside, reason would say to me that children are better off to be older in a younger class, than grappling at a young age in an older class. I think the latter could cause feelings of insufficiency and damage self-esteem. Although there will always be those one or two, which are above the average and shine no matter which environment they are placed in. I am not talking about those, just the average.

Another thought provoking post, hope the ankle biters are both well

Lilla ...

Comment by Lilla

February 11th 2008 03:37
PS as for the kids going back to school here in Queensland in January/February in the heat?

Madness!

They shouldn't even look at returning until (a) they have air conditioning, or (b) 1st March, at least. Imagine, it gets so hot that they are asked to take bottles of water and wet towels to school for the day. They end up exhausted and learn nothing.

Why oh why, don't people realise that we no longer live in a cold climate. We have colonised a hot place that requires afternoon siesta's and new rules. Why can't people realise that tucking in shirts on hot humid days causes unbearable discomfort and I've seen horrible heat rashes.

Imagine here at the primary and public high schools, they have to wear socks and black, rubber runners. They are not allowed leather sandals in the summer, whilst the teachers all go around pratically barefoot.

It's almost as bad as mothers who feed their kids rubbish food, well because it doesn;t matter! *slapping my forehead*

Do you know, I think I shall write to someone about it and start lobbying. Thanks for the idea, I didn't realise I felt so strongly about this stuff... but I do it seems.

Cheers

Comment by Mrs M

February 11th 2008 05:49
Hi Lilla,

A friend of Mr M's sends his children to Steiner where they don't teach children to read until 7. They do a lot of foundation work in those first couple of years and when it's time to read, the children just pick it up and match children that have gone through the traditional schooling process.

My daughter's school only got air conditioning in the year she started. But I remember being so hot. And you're right, no-one learns in that kind of environment.

I find that we homeschool if we don't realise we're doing it. In order to keep Alex occupied when we were out (and out of mischief) was to keep him thinking. So I would alway ask him to find letters, or read numbers or look for things green etc. Until one day my sister-in-law (the one that homeschools) pointed out to me what I was doing.

I was left handed too and I was forced to be right handed. I find that I still use my left hand to do things. What has it done to my brain Lilla?

I agree with you on principle that you would want to your child to be older in a younger class but I really do think that Alex is an exception. He's the sort that seems to thrive on it. Age doesn't concern him, he is that confident, socially. But how do you plead the case to a principal who doesn't know your child and only has a birthdate to go on. Interviews don't last long and orientation is only a couple of hours. They could ring the preschool, but often don't. This is where my sister-in-law would say, 'homeschool them'.

And don't get me started on rubbish food. I've just read a book called Additive Alert and there are so many bad additives out there that I just wasn't aware of. Some of those 'trusted names' out there are using nasty nasty things in their foods.


Love & stuff
Mrs M

Comment by Kleonaptra

February 19th 2008 06:11
I cant remember exactly how old I was but I know I was always younger than everyone else. It SUCKED especially in yr 12 when everyone else went out over the weekend.
Of course now Im still the youngest, which is great fun.....With everyone so afraid of "The Big 30"

Comment by Lilla

February 19th 2008 23:27
Mrs M,

My sister-in-law put her boys through the Steiner system and swore by it. I think they ended up in Luthurian too for a while, after a move to Q, but it didn't suit and they were soon back in Steiner-land. You can do a lot worse.

*chuckle* I have to agree with your sister-in-law, home-school them, you'd be surprised how little you need, besides common sense and well rounded knowledge of the way the world works.. espeically with a European background, and how the modern world has been founded. Hell, learning to bake a chocolate cake is a complete week of science, right there!

You have to ask yourself, what is school for?

What are they really there to learn?

...and how much social interaction is too much... how much does a child really need... and of what calibre?

Isn't struggling through working life enough routine and social interaction, shouldn't childhood be fun, yet still educational? Helping them to learn to manage their own time is one of the fundamental flaws in the public school system, because it just doesn't adress the issue. Bells ring for this and that, telling them when to eat, when to sit and when to run. Most successful people will tell you that good time management is crucial to success... not mindless autonomatons ... *chuckle* just me thinking out loud, sorry.

Big questions and I really hope you find the solutions that suit your family best for peace of mind and true progress..

Lilla ...

PS I cannot find the article I bookmarked amongst my myriad "favourites", but will keep digging, but in summary forcing a child to be right handed (if born left handed), stumps imagination, kills the ability to 'play' and experience true joy, and plays havoc with creative self expression... adding much frustration to a life already complicated enough. I tend to think it stumps true genius ... %-wise, most of them were left handed-you know?

Comment by yoda76

February 19th 2008 23:44
...and how much social interaction is too much... how much does a child really need... and of what calibre?

Isn't struggling through working life enough routine and social interaction, shouldn't childhood be fun, yet still educational?

A very good point, Lilla, but shouldn't we also be trying to arm them with what they need to deal with the struggle of working life - especially the social aspect? I was a complete and utter incompetent fool when it came to socialising, as I never really did much at all outside of school. Once I got to Uni, I was lost.

Lucky for me, Mrs M mistook my social ineptitude (manifested as silently sitting around and not making my presence known) as mystery and alluring nonchalance


Comment by Mrs M

March 4th 2008 14:24
Hi Lilla,

Bells ring for this and that, telling them when to eat, when to sit and when to run. Most successful people will tell you that good time management is crucial to success... not mindless autonomatons ...
Absolutely valid point.

My nephew springs to mind actually. My brother's wife wouldn't let my nephew go to school on his own. He was always taken and picked up. As a consequence, he doesn't really know how to get around because he never paid attention....he didn't have to.

So school might be a bit regimented in that sense, but there are things surrounding school life that teach time management.

My sister in law says she did it to protect him from falling in with the wrong crown and bad situations. But he has no street smarts now....he wouldn't now what a bad situation looks like. Let's see how fast he walks into one.


yoda,

Lucky for me, Mrs M mistook my social ineptitude (manifested as silently sitting around and not making my presence known) as mystery and alluring nonchalance
Just trying to make you look good honey

Love & stuff
Mrs M

Comment by D. Armenta

May 5th 2008 21:44
What a pleasant surprise to come back and see you posting again..I've missed your stuff! (as well as the Silent Mysterious Husband's ever-entertaining comments!)

I'm late on this, but as usual you've made me think again by asking the right questions..dammit.

I think that children will all handle situations differently according to the individual; therefore it must be left to the parents to decide ultimately what the best age is for their child to attend. The feds should have guidelines, yes, but all of this generalizing by age and gender seems to be overcomplicating the issue! Same goes on here across the pond, of course.

I was raised in the 60s-70s, the last era before sweeping social changes about childraising were made here. My parents weren't trying to be a bigger version of kid or my best buddy, they were parents at the tender ages of 24 and 25. Maybe it was because of that attitude I took many things into stride that I've heard more recent parents agonize over?

I started first grade (never attended kindergarten) at age 4. This was because I already knew how to read, add and subtract from Mum reading to us daily when babies and teaching us numbers for fun. Kindy would have been a step back.

Had to take a special test to get into first grade. All the other kids were 5 and some 6. After a few initial social blunders that never mentally scarred me enough to remember in detail, I got along just fine. Biggest problem for me was that the rest of the class were just starting to learn how to read, so I'd get bored and stop paying attention. That was a bad habit that bit me later, but got through that alright too.

Then-yes, always the last one to get driver's license/grow boobs/have menstrual activity/etc.

Again, not mentally scarred.

The best thing about my childhood was knowing that my parents were there to handle the rough stuff; I never got any inkling from them that they were unable to deal with the various disasters that befall all of us in life. Never even gave it a thought!

Some of my friends, though--one's mother used to let us smoke and drink in front of her and talked to us about sex and traded clothes with us. Of course we all thought she was the coolest at the time. When things got to where an adult was needed though? Always went to my parents. I would never trust an overgrown teen like my friend's Mum!

Oh dear, digressed again......sorry!


Comment by yoda76

May 5th 2008 22:06
I never got any inkling from them that they were unable to deal with the various disasters that befall all of us in life.

There's the key right there. We would never share our major problems with the kids - as far as they are concerned, all is hunky-dory!

Comment by Mrs M

May 6th 2008 11:37
Hi D,

My parents never gave any thought to the school either. I was old enough, there was a school around the corner and off I went.

I'm not scarred by any of my schooling. There were some tricky situations but hey, that's life and that's how you learn to navigate your way through the world.

A mum said to me today that she thinks she's been underestimated her child's ability to handle tricky situations. "They're smarter than we given them credit for", she said.

And I believe that the school is very important....probably more important than how old the kid is.

I've actually heard a story from a mum the other day how her son was getting into trouble at school. The mother was naturally upset and so banned the tv, playstation etc etc until he started to behave. The teacher's advice to the mother was to not over-react. This too shall pass.

So refreshing to find a teacher who wasn't going to label a kid a trouble maker.

Love reading your comments D

Love & stuff
Mrs M

Comment by Cheryl J

July 30th 2008 16:16

I was four when I started kindergarten but because of an incredibly inquisitive mind and a love of books, I could read much better than some of the older children which, in a sense, made me feel equal to the older kids. It was difficult in other respects because I was so tiny I was still wearing size three clothing so I got teased a bit about being the baby. Nothing damaging though.

I think the hardest transition for me was starting year 7 in high school while I was still 11 years old. I found that incredibly intimidating. I was younger and smaller than everyone there and it made me very withdrawn and shy. My schoolmates were reaching puberty and I was still years off!

I still think I was ready for school at four as my mother had taught me to read and write and even basic addition and subtraction so I think I would have gotten quite bored if I wasn't in a position to learn more.

Comment by Mrs M

July 31st 2008 03:19
Hi Cheryl,

There's a little girl in my daughter's class who is small. Often strangers mistake her for a preschooler and her mother tells me that she hates that.

At the Athletics carnival, there was this little girl absolutely blitzing girls in her age group.

Her mother told me that she's determined not to be mistaken for a preschooler.

In the face of adversity, she found strength.

I don't anyones entire school career is smooth sailing. But most of us seem to make it through.

Thanks for the visit Cheryl.

Love & stuff
Mrs M

Add A Comment

To create a fully formatted comment please click here.


CLICK HERE TO LOGIN | CLICK HERE TO REGISTER

Name or Orble Tag
Home Page (optional)
Comments
Bold Italic Underline Strikethrough Separator Left Center Right Separator Quote Insert Link Insert Email
Notify me of replies
Notify extra people about this comment
Is this a private comment?
List the Email Addresses or Orble Tags of the people you would like to be notified about this comment


One per line max of 30

List the Email Addresses or Orble Tags of the people you would like to be notified about this private comment thread. Only the people in this list will be able to see or reply to your comment.


One per line max of 30

Your Name
(for the email going out to the above list, it can be different to your Orble Tag)
Your Email Address
(optional)
(required for reply notification)
Submit
More Posts
1 Posts
2 Posts
1 Posts
159 Posts dating from November 2006
Email Subscription
Receive e-mail notifications of new posts on this blog:
0
Moderated by Mrs M
Copyright © 2006 2007 2008 On Topic Media PTY LTD. All Rights Reserved. Design by Vimu.com.
On Topic Media ZPages: Sydney |  Melbourne |  Brisbane |  London |  Birmingham |  Leeds     [ Advertise ] [ Contact Us ] [ Privacy Policy ]